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Rumor-and-Speculation : Will We Ever Get It Right?
Winthrop / Prium Update and Rumors
The city council will vote tonight to approve a $2 million UDAG loan (Urban Development Action Grant) to Prium for the redevelopment of the hotel and relocation of its residents.
The question many of us have been having is, what is Prium’s plan for the the low income residents? Unfortunately, from what we hear, Prium is planning on moving the housing units currently at the Winthrop to Hilltop, most likely to 1100 MLK, in a single block. Interestingly, the plan by the City Manager to redefine downtown to just shy of MLK would put this proposed new facility outside of the area protected by the Miller Amendment.
If true, this rumor would be a definite blow to the original spirit of the Winthrop Hotel idealists who thought that this would be an opportunity to split the Winthrop’s section 8 voucher into several smaller units. I really hope there’s more to this story that we haven’t heard yet…
Link | Posted on 9. January 2007, 09:11
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if that is the case, just another great example of our fantastic leadership here…...just when Hilltop is trying to become something and folks are buying the homes to clean up etc…..hmm…...
1 | Posted by Rich | Jan 9, 09:34 AM
How hard is this to figure out, anyway? Lumping all low-income residents together creates ghettos, not solutions.
We have to hold them accountable. Go to the meeting and speak out.
2 | Posted by rc | Jan 9, 09:55 AM
Let me say first that I am all for keeping the low income housing in smaller units spread through the Theater District, the St. Helens hill, and other downtown areas. Mixing low income with luxury condos will help stave off gentrification and keep the neighborhoods from becoming playgrounds of the rich.
That said, it’s possible that the condo boom in that area means that it may be too late for the St. Helens hill and Theater District. Gentrification may have already set in.
So maybe moving low income to MLK isn’t all bad. Home prices in the hilltop have been skyrocketing, if not more than doubling in just a couple years. (I learned that a large amount of young Seattle-ites are choosing that area to live, according to the head of the MLK Housing Assoc.) The low-income move to MLK might be the best thing to keep the neighborhood from pricing out people that currently call the area a home.
Of course, moving the same amount of units from the Winthrop into a single city block is a very very bad idea. But I’m not opposed to the move to MLK in principle if they can do it right.
3 | Posted by erikemery | Jan 9, 10:01 AM
I knew deep down I despised those Prium folks. It is just as well… all their condos look like frat houses for scumbags.
4 | Posted by RR Anderson | Jan 9, 10:13 AM
What I don’t understand is – why can’t the current residents find their own section 8 housing, among what is available already, over the next 2 years?
It would be as if your lease is not being renewed on an apartment. You would then need to find another place on your own.
5 | Posted by Gorman | Jan 9, 10:35 AM
Just another example of a great idea turning into disappoitment in Tacoma…...
6 | Posted by Rich | Jan 9, 11:15 AM
The redevelopment of the Winthrop is still a good thing. The disappointment is that it reinforces stereotypes and perspectives. When the original developers and leaders were talking about the Winthrop as hotel they brought a lot of low income housing people into the room so that a better way could be developed. The solution that we may be getting seems to ignore that hope. However, new construction may be better than the as-is.
I realize that working with HUD to change the model may be the roadblock, but I wonder how much effort was put into trying to shift the paradigm.
I’m hoping to be surprised and that this thread is wrong.
7 | Posted by Derek | Jan 9, 11:21 AM
I have been wondering about the quanity of breaks and money that the city is willing to advance to Prium. I think this is another good example of trying to be too many things to too many projects. Just 6 months ago I sat at a business meeting in the Hilltop where the development of the 1100 blk of MLK was announced. This was met with great excitement. I wonder if the reaction would have been the same if we had known this project too would be another opportunity for the city to dump more low income housing in the middle of a retail core that is struggling to survive. If the city continues to support these big projects that lump low income groups into one area (trust me the Hilltop already has more than its share) it will never see improvement in these areas, and the business that are trying to exsist there will have not choice but to relocate.
8 | Posted by gray | Jan 9, 11:52 AM
this is tough. the obvious answer is not to concentrate poverty. maybe split up the residents into existing downtown housing, salishan, NE tacoma, and Wapato area? that is of course if the residents would like to live there.
9 | Posted by snoopy | Jan 9, 12:59 PM
Unfortunately, from what we hear, Prium is planning on moving the housing units currently at the Winthrop to Hilltop, most likely to 1100 MLK, in a single block.
I think there is a good chance that the properties will be split up in some manner.
Having worked on the Winthrop Hotel issue over the last year, I can say that there have been extraordinary efforts to have the housing split over several properties. However, HUD has some requirements that makes this difficult.
The Quigg group had the low income housing people work on this issue continuously and they are still working on it with hope that the new representatives in Washington DC, and some who are now in better positions, will be able to make some progress on it.
I know the city has had their staff work continuously on the issue as well. The issue is ironic as HUD recommends that low income housing not be concentrated in a single area, yet they make it hard to accomplish this.
In event, all of the Winthrop units will not have to be located in one place. Not all of the units in the Winthrop are full and only a portion of the residents there have the HUD voucher which would require them to be at the same spot.
The solution that we may be getting seems to ignore that hope. However, new construction may be better than the as-is.
Yes, far better. Even if the HUD vouchers cannot be split up, the new low income housing units will likely be more disbursed.
Also, the Winthrop is a very poor design with all of the units sharing one entrance and interior hallways and violates about every known quantity we know about how to design successful low income housing. See Defensible Space by HUD.
The new low income housing units being built in Pierce County are designed better than the Winthrop.
They are also going to be a great benefit for residents. The new units will likely be designed much better and bigger and than the current Winthrop rooms.
10 | Posted by Erik | Jan 9, 01:00 PM
Has anyone ever forwarded this type of thread of valid commentary from community members to some department over at Prium??
Or contacted them to propose some sort of open meeting/forum? Or would any attempt simply be disregarded and a waste of time?
11 | Posted by Kate | Jan 9, 02:31 PM
Regardless of where the units are ultimately located, HUD’s own research has shown for years that concentrating these vouchers is a negative impact. There are plenty of articles available about how to decentralize and deconcentrate these populations. The Hilltop area already has a significant concentration. These new units need to be integrated into other areas that don’t have their fair share currently. On a broader scale, that includes Pierce County. There are already protections in place for areas surrounding Hilltop – downtown has the Miller Amendment, North Slope is protected by an overlay zone. The rest of the city deserves the same consideration as these areas. This isn’t a new issue for Tacoma, many other areas are studying it as well. We do have Fair Share principles in the Comprehensive Plan. These will need to be followed regardless of where Prium wants to locate the housing stock – big or small. This needs to be a long term discussion and approach. Unfortunately this is a side effect of the good aspects of the hotel being redeveloped.
12 | Posted by M.W. | Jan 9, 02:42 PM
Just reviewed the meeting last night at which the city council voted unanimously to support the loan to Prium (from federal funds) to restore the Winthrop Hotel.
There were a number of drafts of the agreement. The final one voted on included language that the borrower (Prium) is to create replacement housing with multiple sites throughout the city with city approval within 24 to 36 months of closing.
It was nice to hear some of the council comments which stressed that although the renovation is going to take some time, the change in management of the Winthrop should reduce some of the problems in the area.
13 | Posted by Erik | Jan 10, 01:25 PM
One thing that has not been mentioned is this thread is the individuals that currently live in the Winthrop. While relocation of these people all over the city is a great idea, we need to remember who we’re talking about here. Many of the current residents of the Winthrop are likely disabled, mentally ill, or are senior citizens living on fixed incomes. They do not (and often cannot) drive all over the place like all of us can. They rely either on their own two feet (or wheelchair) or Pierce Transit to get around. Therefore, living in an area like downtown or Hilltop is a necessity, because these neighborhoods are home to or close to multiple hospitals and social service agencies that assist many of the Winthrop’s residents, as well as the highest concentration of bus routes in the city .
Therefore, relocating low-income people to the isolated far reaches of the city, where bus service is often sporadic and social service agencies sparse, may not be the wisest choice.
14 | Posted by drizell | Jan 11, 07:36 AM
Simply because a service provider is nearby is not a valid reason to saturate one area with people who need assistance. These services should likewise be spread throughout the city. Which comes first the chicken or the egg? If we spread these people out, the service providers will need to change their thinking as well in order to serve their clients. I understand that transportation is also an issue. All of these considerations need to be made when locating the housing and people. There is still a way to make this a win-win situation since nothing has been built yet.
15 | Posted by M.W. | Jan 11, 09:27 AM
There are other low income housing buildings in hilltop these ones can relocate to. Besides, pretty much anywhere else in Tacoma has bus service. We’re not talking about sending these people to Graham.
16 | Posted by Gorman | Jan 11, 10:04 AM
“... all their condos look like frat houses for scumbags.”
HA! – I just got it (I’m slow).
17 | Posted by Dave L. | Jan 11, 11:24 AM
I’m surprised by the apparent indignation shown toward Prium by some of the commenters on this site. I am aware that many of the people here were very involved with the Citizens Hotel group; however, just because the Quigg/Trabucco proposal did not come to fruition, I don’t think this is the appropriate forum for bashing Prium.
Let’s at least give them some credit for some of their current projects and the initiative they have shown in creating a sense of place where none existed before.
18 | Posted by drizell | Jan 11, 06:44 PM
I am aware that many of the people here were very involved with the Citizens Hotel group; however, just because the Quigg/Trabucco proposal did not come to fruition, I don’t think this is the appropriate forum for bashing Prium.
I don’t think you will find any members of the Quigg Trabucco group with anything but compliments for Prium including Quigg personally. We discussed it on several occassions and I keep in contact with a number of them.
There were numerous steps to take the far fetched dream of restoring the Winthrop Hotel to reality. The downtown merchants basically led the first phase of the Winthrop Hotel effort and the Quigg group stepped up and led the second part.
Prium deserves alot of credit for taking the final step in a long process, and yet, we still have a distance to go.
(and there were people who raised the issue before last year as well).
19 | Posted by Erik | Jan 11, 07:31 PM
Just curious, which one of Priums projects are complete?
20 | Posted by rich | Jan 11, 09:46 PM
I believe they have projects in other cities that are either complete or are coming along. In Tacoma, Hanna Heights and Chelsea Heights are nearing completion from the looks of it. Jay Heights is on hold. 1933 Dock St. is being permitted. There may be more. I’m not too familiar with Prium’s activities outside T-Town.
21 | Posted by drizell | Jan 13, 03:15 PM
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